Category: accessible Devices
Well, as I've stated several times, I was going to get an iPhone 4, and that did happen. As I messed around with it, I did notice a sudden drop in signal. However, when I messed with the phone app and called my bank, I did not notice any breaking up or call failure. So what does this mean? It means that there is no antenna issue on this phone and I think that the problem is that the signal that is displayed isn't accurate. When it says that there's 1 bar of signal, it just doesn't act like there's 1 bar. Typically, when there is only 1 bar, you'll usually experience a little breaking up of the calls and sometimes call failure. This isn't the case with the iPhone. So in short, whenever you get an iPhone 4, rest assured that antenna issues are only caused by a small amount of whiners who can't seem to keep their mouths shut.
Evidently not so small since Apple's stock has taken a hit because of it. Personally I'll feel more comfortable waiting until the problem, whatever it is, has been really taken care of. In the meantime I'll get an IPhone 3GS or, if I have to get a fourG, a protective case for it since those are said to help with that. And I'd want a case for my IPhone anyway if at all possible so it's not really a big deal. But getting back on topic I'd feel comfortable wih the new IPhone if the guage or whatever that monitors and displays network signal strength were as accurate as possible. I'd hate for it to display an optimum signal or whatever only to discover that in actuality it was going to drop my call because the signal was too weak.
well apples stock took a hit because of people blowing something out of proportion and thus giving them a lot of bad press for something thats partially AT&T fault. They did fix the mesurement with an update t to the OS so it does display bars more accurately now. And incase u don't believe this is partially and issue with AT&T why does this only happen in the US and nowhere else. Though apple has once again proven why they are the kings of customer service ans set the model for all others to follow by giving everyone with an iPhone 4 a free case .. and giving them a variety of cases to choose from as well. So put it in a case and you will have better reception than on the 3GS.. personally i say quit waiting and go get one already but thats just me.
yeah but it took a lawsuit for them to start giving out free cases and no this problem is not only in the United States.
this is what i've been trying to ge tpeople to understand. it, is not only apple that has these problems. when nokia tried to use this to their advantage they really got themselves hit hard for it. and it took a law suit? that was someone going way too far, trying to make as much noise as possible so they would have their little moment of fame, oh, and maybe get lots and lots of money as a bonus.
Oh? A lawsuit? I actually hadn't heard that. But from what I've ehard about Apple I wouldn't be surprised if the lawsuit was indeed just some idiot wanting to make a big stink and maybe get a lot of money. They only make it hard for those few who do have legitimate reasons to sue, and I've observed that that's a number that's been in a rapid decline for years. As for the quit waiting comment I sort of have to wait since my contract isn't yet up for renewal and that's when I want to get my IPhone. Besides, I'll be more likely to have the money for it whether I get a job between now and then or not. And t's only December that I have to wait for so it's not really all that long.
I'm going to take the word of antenna engineers who've done tests over people on this site,and they say it was a poorly thought out design that does have problems. Apple should have manned up as son as this problem was discovered and started giving away free cases. They probably shipped knowing this was a problem and just hoped they could do damage control. Charging $30 for a case that costs less then $1 to make is idiodic when it's your device's problem the case fixes, they should have been given away free from the start.
Sure, their are design issues, But, they don't effect the daily use of the phone in any noticable way. I have a iPhone, know others that have the 4 as well and out of us all, no one's dropped a call yet. I can't even make the death grip drop my signal. Yes, the problem happens to a slight degree in other countries but, it is made worse because ATT has a different modle for cell tower distrobution than the rest of the world. Then again, its probably easier to blanket europe with more towers in more places than here. While I agree, apple should have and could have acted faster, the media blue this way out of proportion. And then other companies got pissed when apple started pointing out antenna flaws in their devices. Sure, it was slightly childish to try to shift the blame as it were. Though, apple made a valid point. They arn't the only ones by far and it seemes most journalists get a kick out of destabilizing or knocking something down that has gained a lot of noterioty and popularity. This issue probably could have and would have been handled much better if pulitser hungry fools didn't cry woolf when at most their was a sighting of a fox.
Jared you're fighting Apple religious zealots so I doubt reasonable arguments like you or I could make will mean anything. Arguments like as you pointed out, the independent benchmark studies on antennas and, let's go eaven simpler, if this is such a smartphone-wide problem, why didn't the iPhone 3GS, or even the 3G have this problem?
Go back far enough though and we see when iPhone first came out (yes, there is a world beyond the blinkosphere), they justified the dropped calls, processor problems and all sorts of issues.
There's no doubt that AT&T does need to improve their network. That's obvious. I don't care how fast their network is or anything like that, they do need to be more widespread in order to attract more people. This is no antenna problem, folks, this is AT&T's problem, but Apple's taking the hit for it. And by the way, Apple's stalks have gone bck up; they're around 260 right now. Believe it or not, there are some cities where you won't get any reception at all from any At&T phone because there are no towers there, hence why I said that they need to improve their network.
And if the person who started the lawsuit wouldn't have been such an idiot to blame Apple for these issues, he could have at least swung the bat at AT&T for their poorly developed network.
Yeah, this is my third post in a row, but I thought of something else. I do agree that Apple should have acted faster in providing those free cases for better reception.
Most of the posts here are stupid.
If it's not a hardware issue as some of you are suggesting, why is a new revision of the ip4 going to be released in september?
The problem has to do with the hardware, apple trying to make there device seem better than it is and in some situations the provider.
Also, it's pretty obvious imo that apple new about the problem but just hoped that they'd be able to get away with it:
This is the first time that they have offered cases for sale.
In ios4, the tweak that let you view the signal in db's as opposed to bars was removed. Strange how this more accurate method of viewing the signal was removed to co-inside with the release of the ip4.
A week or so before people first started having issues, a job posting appeared on the apple site for an antenna enginear.
It's true that *some* phones are slightly deceptive about how much signal you actually have, however, the reason why this hasn't ever been noticed before is because they don't lie as much as apple did in the original ios4. Having said this, as others have mentioned, several people who know much more about antennas than people on here have commented on the poor design.
This is a classic example of where despite what they say, the company does not value the customer. Even if everyone in apple thought that there wasn't a problem, a large number of there customers did, there for, there is a problem.
Live by the sword, die by the sword. Apple has garnerred tremendous positive media coverage, so when something does not go right the media will cover that too.
What I have never liked about Apple is the almost religious or fanatic devotion of Apple fans and the anti Apple stance of those who do not like the products.
I never seem to be able to get objective views and coverage of Apple products.
In my experience, and that is coming from a Windows screen reader user, I find VoiceOver pretty horrible, though I am very imprssed with the quality of their tts voices and that VO is very good, coming as a free and built in screen reading app.
What little I have tested of the IPhone and Touch seems very cool and I applaud innovation by Apple there.
Wildebrew I hope you try an iPad. And you know from my other posts where I come from, but the spatial use of the touch screen, when it's clipboard sized like that is positively amazing! Now that I used one for a few minutes I really do want one.
The keyboard makes a ton more sense because it's netbook-sized and I just put my hands on the area. You'll be shocked at what you find. I wouldn't want to use VoiceOver without a trackpad or touch pad but using a touch screen like that, where you really can use the spatial aspects you already know as a programmer is really really nice. I read a news article that I knew started in the middle of the page, and no having to skip out of frames and the like I just found it, and then scrolled down it read one screen at a time, ignoring the ads to the side because I was directing to stay in the middle where the text was.
I don't think I'd like a dinky iPhone but my mentor in the Coast Guard uses an iPad as a total productivity tool, I looked at his apps and they all pretty much worked, or at least I could find my way around with no problems.
To do the same with a Windows reader, at least without a touch screen, you'd turn on its mouse cursor then bump your way around with the arrows, I do that all the time but to just tap close to where you need in the middle of free open space, then slide an inch or so onto the hot spot you're good. I guess if space and a two-dimensional environment were challenging for a blind person maybe it wouldn't work but I've gotta say I really felt I could do a lot with amazing speed there.
And this comes from someone who has been, and still is, a critic of a lot of Apple's policies. My criticisms as I've said before go way before the blinkosphere knew about Apple products, back to System 7 when they tried to tell us Apple users didn't really need networks.
While I think they as a company can be positively ridiculous, a device like an iPad is a relatively closed system but you can use it as a cloud device as my mentor does: Google Documents app (which was reading with the reader) Dropbox, Twitterrific, their book reader (which you can use to read tons of stuff) and the list goes on. Frankly I wouldn't care much about games or music with it, it's value to me would be in the productivity without the proclivity to die. You really should check one of those out because the size and real estate makes all the difference.
I certainly plan to try those tings out.
My biggest issues with the IPad, per ce, are incompatibility with Flash and Java, and those stem from Apple´s corporate policies, not hardware or software problems.
That being said, Apple seems to be the first company in years to try someting new for accessible user interface, i.e. touching and gestures for the blind user as well as the sighted, and also giving the user a spatial awareness of web pages, something traditional screen readers have no interest in doing.
To be fair, if the page you quote uses headings or text starts after a bunch of links the "h" key or "n" key in most screen readers should jump you right to the article, but there is no guarantee that it would be well written and also text is often broken up by Flash or other commercials, and I have never known whether said ads are within the text itself or the screen reader rendering just puts them in the midst of the articles.
But it sounds very cool if you can focus on the text with gestures.
When I have more money IPad is definitely on the shopping list, and I am hopeful it will spur some kind of increase in innovation for other devices and software (I am looking at you Google and Talkback).
Didn't you hear me say that this issue is only affecting a small amount of people? AT&T even confirms that it's not affecting everyone, only those who can't keep their mouths shut and quit whining. You guys can call me a fanboy or a religious fanatic if you want, but this hardware problem really isn't a problem. Steve Jobs explicitly stated that he received thousands of e-mails saying that the phone worked perfectly and that there were no problems with the antenna. So don't you dare call me stupid because I've had experience with this iPhone and I haven't received any dropped calls as some people are claiming. I rest my case.
I understand and have never liked Jobs' co-optive perspective. At one time long long ago, way before the Blinkosphere even knew about macs, Sir Jobs opted to produce a series of Macs with no arrow keys. Why? To make users use the mouse, because, "They'll like it!"
They're doing it again with Flash and no, I don't like that either.
Fanboys have very short memories.
As to the Windows readers doing it or not doing it, that has to do with the hardware. What was so amazing is not the reader, as much as interaction with the touch screen, meaning no longer are you bumping around with the arrows or other keys, you are literally and visually tapping exactly where you know something is. In fact for years I've tried to get close to that without thinking about it, by using the whiz wheels on my display in combination with the reader's mouse cursor to boing around quickly but no matter how you slice it, there is something very unique to the multi-touch / gesture environment. I don't know what would happen on Windows, because before any reader even got close to it, you'd have all sorts of companies with proprietary drivers, then the interfaces would get reinvented every couple of years, then you'd have legacy support, all necessities of making Windows what it is. Ironically, much of that is why I find Windows so incredibly productive in a commercial environment - where Apple is nearly nonexistent. However, as sort of a cloud-terminal device / individual productivity tool I could see the iPad being a great option.
I recently set a client up with an iPad for communication purposes, but before doing so, I got an opportunity to use it for a week or so for everyday on the rode productivity. Hands down, I felt like I got more accomplished than I ever do with my netbook. I just sometimes hate having to load my netbook up, wait for my 3g to do it's thing and then check email, ETC ETC. It was nice having that responsiveness right there and typing really was a breaze with the larger screen realistate.
As for browsing the web, it is nice having a sighted person say, it's in the bottom left of the page, and low and behold it really is in the bottom left, not off in some virtual buffer somewhere.
I won't buy one yet, as I'm sure in the next itteration of the device in september there'll be a camera, so I'll hang on for now, but I certainly plan to get one.
True, the iPad is a good little device for productivity. I am with you on the fact that they should have added a flash player plugin, especially to that device. And I think another thing that people don't know is that when the first gen iPhone came out, the standard 3.5 mm headsets weren't supported. That, right there, makes no sense to me as to why they didn't just put the standard 3.5 mm jack in that phone. Everybody else used those jacks except for them.
According to www.blindbargains.com the new Apple TrackPad will allow visual interactions and touch based gestures and it works with VoiceOver (to what degree I do not know).
Now, that would be extremely cool if it really works as well as say, the iPad.
I know some users say they´ve always done something this way and it works and that´s fine for them, but I am concerned, we must move in the same direction technology is and not be left behind.
Therefore the idea of a usable and accessible gesture based touch screen type device that works out of the box with a screen reader, is a huge plus in Apple´s book.
I am still holding of on either a Mac Mini or iPad for now, as I would use them more as toys. My testof Office applications (iWorks) was a resounding lack of success, at least the Excel part, they do not have the same programming environments as I am used to working in Windows (Eclipse, Visual Studio), so Apple does not make much sense for me yet. But I am getting incrasingly interested in what they are doing, especially since Freedom Scientific seems to spend way more money on law suits than on development, and it seems the passion and commitment to users is gone .. again, sorry I do not mean to get off topic here, but the constant law suits against their clients and the ogovernment piss me off to no end.
Cheers
-B
Freedom Scientific seems to be going underwater now. I own a Freedom Scientific product, so I can say that for sure. I have a PAC Mate Omni, which hasn't been updated for almost 2 years now due to a bunch of lazy asses, or perhaps even money hogs, won't try to update it to make it better in terms of its stability. The 6.5 update better be a really good one, or else I'm just simply going to get rid of it and stick with Apple. Not Microsoft, Apple. I may not agree on everything that Apple does, but I do like their products, which does include the Mac. I don't think I'll get an iPad, but a Mac is the next thing on my list.
I like what apple is doing for us lind users but personally beeing a Mud Gamer I will stick to windows7. I belive Microsoft did a very good job with that OS. yes they have a crappy Narator screenreader but there are free screenreaders out there on the market who seems to do very well like NDVA
Myself, I will be waiting for a true resolution before I attempt an iPhone 4. My 3GS works well. If Consumer Reports recommends it, I'll investigate it again.
first off back in 2007 most phones i encountered were still using the mini headphones jack and not the standard 3.5mm ones so apple really wasn't going against the grain on that one. All the reports i have seen said no one is having issues with the antennas like we are outside of the US, and if they are its not to the same degree. I agree if the antenna was gona be placed outside where it is it should of had some kind of coating on it so it wouldn't react to the touch the way it did. However and i have seen this demonstrated, if you are in really good AT&T coverage area u don't drop calls despite what the bars say when u hold it in the death grip. if you aren't then u drop calls when in that grip. So it seems its a joint issue for apple and at&t. And if you paid attention to the press conference on apples campus where they announced the free cases, You would of heard all the press asking why can't they make the death grip thing happen here, answer was becaus there was an AT&T cell tower on campus. Oh and the lawsuit had nothing to do with them giving out the cases btw. Yes i agree the bumper cases aren't worth the $30 apple is charging for them and especially after recieving my free one and actually using it i will say it solves the problem. While i wasn't dropping calls i did notice sometimes while trying to use the phone while it was in my pocket my hand would cover the blluetooth antenna and thus all audio would get choppy ..no longer an issue with the case. And while conspiracy theroist and apple haters will say that the bumper case was available at launch cuz apple knew about the problem, how about this, it the first major redesign of the phone since cases started to become really popular for them .. and thus no case would be available at launch so they did their own. but hey i must be drinking the apple cool aid if i believe that one right. I believe in using the right tool for the job, i wont switch to a mac because accessibility for audio production isn't where i need it to be yet. but for my Phone so far its the best option out there.
And for those of you bitching up a storm about flash,.. have you seen what a resource hog flash is, not to mention the wealth of bugs and security issues it has that adobe is constantly trying to patch? There are valid reason why they aren't allowed on the iPhone. There is a dedicated YouTube app that comes on the phone so u don't have to worry about youtube, and most other popular flash sites have a mobile version or an iPhone app so yeah there are a few sites that u can't visit from the phones web browser but to be honest i really can't complain about the lack of flash after seeing what it does to other phones and even some older PCs.
Sure, the hole antennagate issue looks quite bad for apple all things considered. Just because I haven't had issues doesn't mean others have. I just dont get why people need to flaim apple or microsoft or any company to quite the extent they doo. But, regardless of why or what or what have you, apple made a fix. Things look a little wishy woshy but in all honesty, all any of us can doo is speculate based on facts we've been given here. On the bright side, this might wake apple up a little to the fact that people are watching them and they need to think about everything a little more before they just let things run loose.
From what i've hurd of why apple doesn't want flash on their phone, it makes sense to quite a degree.
They tried to work with adobie to get a product that was less resource intensive and more battery friendly.Adobie desided they didn't need to meat apples standard so apple didn't include them. Yeh, that's just speculation done by others but, that's been the same line We've basicly hurd from apple and many offiliated with them so, I'm a little more apt to believe it. though, I still take it with a bit of a grain of sault.
When apple has a new technology like html five that meats their requirements, I could see them not wanting to bend over and take it from adobie, even though their solution isn't as popular. Apple's trying to start another revolution, who knows if it will work. Mabie if Adobie cleans up their product, or if apple faces enough crap for not having flash, something will come of it. But, It shouldn't effect me much either way, unless their are security holes in flash that hackers deside to exploit. then again, I OS 4 has a few interestingly bad security holes. The hole flash vs no flash issue is another that makes apple look a little stubborn but, when it comes down to it, it is their product, they have the right to reject or approve what they'd like to support.
I honestly don't see apples move to lock down their SDK agreement as all that of a bad thing. Its one issue that I don't mind giving up all that much freedom over. Though, it annoies mostly adobie because they can't shoehorn their product on the device regardless of what apple wants. That could be a bad thing in the interest ofopenness and the like.But, I think that if adobie really wanted on I OS, they'd be working to clean up their act, rather than throwing what equates to temper tantrums. Their could be true antytrust/anty compotition issues with these policies but, it still looks like adobie's trying to take the easy way out.
I do see wheir people are coming from saying consumers should have the choice. I agree they should have the choice to use their devices how they like. But, I also see to a degree wheir apple's comeing from thinking that their are many stupid consumers that will not read instructions or will not take things seriously or will not do a number of things. I'm not sure if I can totally blaim them for not wanting to take that flack. Because i'd bet you any money, if flash was on the device, reviewers would blaim apple, not adobie for adobies part in the issues.
Mabie i'm not looking at it objectively enough, who knows.
Either way, I think people will bitch about anything. Its just human nature to look for the bad, not the good, when it comes to tell a story.
Sorry about the errors in this, I rushed threw it.
Here's my major problem with Apfle and Flash. Sure they want to support html 5. Problem: So do the rest of us. However, users, consumers, don't choose. They visit a banking or other page because they need it, and a good majority of it is written in Flash. This punishes the user for what many users see as academic. And they are at a meeting or site, and can't view a particular page they nethe to on their iPad, while other tablets can. That's it. It's a pissing contest with existing web infrastructure and the only ones getting wet are the users in the middle.
and thats why most major organizations have iPhone apps now to get around that issue, and you know what .. it ends up being more secure in the end. And And comsumers do have choices if thats really important to you then get an android phone or windows mobile or nokia or other. But after seeing how flash ran on some other phones i am not missing it on this one. Apple had an opportunity to start a new platform from the ground up and decided to take certain mesures to make it more secure, yeah that means locking it down yeah there are some inconviences but as any security expert will tell you conveiniance is the ememy of security. Yeah i don't agree with some of their app store policies, like them deciding what's adult content and not letting it fly in the app store yet they sell r rated movies and music with explicit lyrics, but so far apple has seem to be slowly weening the world off flash and we now have the technology to render flash obselete so why not?
Your point is well taken, but most users aren't thinking about whether or not something has flash. They don't even know what flash really is, they just browse the web to a site and there's the flash. In some cases so much of it their page doesn't display properly at all. I may well get an iPad for myself but I know enough to know what's happening when I encounter a page like that.
If they had thought about it longer, they could have advised the developers of sites, not Adobe, about the change and added a Safari-specific tag which Safari would use to give the user the choice of installing the app from their Pad, Pod or phone right there. As it is, they have to find out about the app, go into the store and hunt it up and get it. Most users won't take that kind of time, or remember all that they need to do. Support thousands of users and you'll know. It's the user issue troubles me more than anything. I know, many would like to shoot me for suggesting yet another browser-specific tag, but it's possible and an individual site who has invested tens of thousands of dollars into flash development can XCode an iPhone app, use the tag on the main site to determine if iPad or if iOS and prompt user to install their related application through the store. Done deal if Apple were with it when it comes to playing provider for massive numbers of users, something Apple isn't very good at yet.
And if flash were to be implemented into one of Apple's devices such as the iPad, the question would be if it would be accessible with VoiceOver. Since it isn't accessible with Windows screen readers, I would think it would be the same way with the iPad's VoiceOver. If companies can make iPhone and iPad apps where you can get around the flash stuff, then I'm totally fine with not having flash implemented on those devices. I think it's obvious that the reason that Adobe is making a big deal out of this is because they don't want to go out of business, even though Microsoft has Adobe products built into them. You can correct me if I'm wrong on that, but I think that's what's happening here. And when I was saying that Apple should have implemented the standard 3.5 mm jacks when the first iPhone came out, I was pretty much making reference to their iPods and how most of them had those jacks. My mother got an iPod way back in 2005, so I can tell you for sure that that's what Apple was using for them. And as far as the iPhone antenna goes, I've noticed some weak communication betwen the phone itself and the sim card. There were some points when I turned the iPhone on and it didn't detect the sim card installed in it. It doesn't happen all the time, so it's really nothing to really worry about, but I have a feeling that that is why the antenna might be causing problems. Of course I haven't dropped any calls yet, but the sim card communication is my theory on the loss of signal.
I could care less about Adobe in particular, it's the site infrastructure that uses flash to do things like control embedded web conferences (which, FWIW, the iPad would display better than many desktop computers), store software, all sorts of technologies.
And Windows readers, even NVDA, support flash. There is good and bad flash all over: accessibility being one component of either good or bad flash. You won't get me to defend or fight Flash: I supported it when it was Macromedia in 1996 and nothing more than the bouncing yellow ball on sites. And no, as a blink, I could not use it. However, Flash has grown over time as a platform environment, into which many companies have invested untold thousands of dollars to do internet-based applications. Here again, users blind or otherwise don't even know they're benefiting or otherwise from Flash half the time. Your reader, any modern reader, will read flash on Windows and I imagine on the Mac though I don't know. The flash just needs to use some standard interfaces for rendering actual names for controls, but there are good reasonns that exceed accessibility for doing that anyway. Flash is a platform, there are open-source tools to create Flash controls, it simply exists. It's not my favorite platform by any means: it tends to hog memory among other things, but it exists and is a major part of the web as we know it. I'm as hot and excited about the cross-platform intelligent implications of html 5, but I've been working in software the past fifteen years, not in school, so the practical necessity of supporting legacy architecture so often complained about on here and elsewhere, is paramount. Users are using it without knowing it. Companies can't justify to their investors tearing down entire infrastructures (in this case written in Flash) for an instant rewrite. Not if they have a significant customer base who depends on their site / software working all the time every day.
Typically what happens is that modules, or pieces parts, of a given structure get redone over time, so that what you get is a constantly evolving set: The user notices changes here and there, but an old platform gets phased out and a new one phased in. Drastic usurpish measures are typical for idealists who don't have very many customers and work in academia. The rest of us deal with the real world: real users who don't care what the name of a platform is, they just run software X to do Y task because Z result is required. Don't get me wrong: No love lost on Flash from me. I don't know a single developer who doesn't bitch about it - the blinkosphere only knows about accessibility but ooh are there so many other reasons to belly-ache about that particular platform. However, it's ubiquitous and lots of infrastructure that users depend upon is written in it.
Once Apple finally grows up and plays like a big boy, not a schoolchild idealist anymore, they will realize this. Sooner rather than later I suspect, because they are no longer the Macademia (as we used to call them), the little elite of users with noses stuck to the ceiling. iPad sales have been enormous. The marketing stunt with combination iPod and iTunes to introduce Windows users to Apple software in 2003 or thereabouts was a well-placed maneuver. But now it's time to stop being the little idealist, grow a pair, and start dealing honestly with customer issues.
Don't pull a 1996 and tell customers Mac users don't need network connectivity, and don't pull a 2010 and tell customers they don't need flash. Customers expect modern devices to plug into existing infrastructure and work. The greatest challenges in software aren't the rewrites, or the foot-stomping "You will do it this way!", but in integrating new ideas into legacy / existing infrastructure so users can continue to be productive while experiencing your new paradigm, often ultimately editting out *over time* inadequate infrastructure. Sorry if I ranted geek, but I'm only passionate about this stuff because it's ultimately users who pay the price. And we developers have to assume users are depending on us to plug them into the infrastructure they need to use. I don't decide what my users use, they decide. Rather often they already have decided, out of necessity or otherwise.
One thing that looks awesome cause my good friend has an iphone is the abillity to run android operating system on an iphone. I dunno how he did it because I'm a lil slow when it comes to tech in general but i know it can be done and its pretty cool...
its only relatively recently that phones have had full browsers that were capable of doing flash, so people are used to sites not looking or working the same on mobile phones, and even platforms that support flash not all flash sites look and work the same. Also most major sites have some kind of browser detection built in and will display a message somewhere when it picks up that you are visiting from and iPhone or Android phone that the app is available so the average user will find out that way. Just like how if it sences you are visiting from a mobile platform it will forward you to the mobile site. As great as these devices are they are not full on computers and are still appliances geared towards media consumption than anything else. We still need computers for certain things and i feel thats the way it will remain untill a way to bring those same functionality to a mobile device without killing the battery or bringing it to ascreeching halt is found. I agree that you can't just it takes time to re do a whole large infostructure thats done in flash and it wont happen overnight, but untill someone with a large enough market share draws a a line in the sand and say no, no one would have any motivation or incentive to update their infostructure to something that requires a full overhaul. If flash were on the iPhone you think HTML5 and other alternative that could bring forth a better user experience would be getting the push it is from the industry now? As for the point about the headphone jack .. may i once again point how this is a phone with a media player and it was standard for phones to have the mini headphone jack like all other phones that played media did at the time, where as mp3 players and other devices made specifically for music listening always had the standard headphone jack. Fortunately now its standard to fine the standard headphone jack on most phones.
To post 33. I agree with you on many points. I just think its sad that sometimes companies have to pull stunts for componies with a monopoly to listen up at all. Flash is a crap platform, for many reasons. At least in my opinion. Apple didn't want it associated with their devices because they apairently didn't like it either. Sure, apple's takeing a verry idealist point of view but, when adobie isn't willing to work with them at all, what else should apple do? Just nuckle under for the sake of the user? Their are 2 completely different answers to this question. On one hand, your user is the most important person in the equasion. On the other, their won't be any hope of forcing change if someone doesn't stand furm and tell adobie, if you want on our platform, you need to focus on quality, for a change.
Adobie it seemes would rather bully apple and use their resources to paint them as evil for not buying in. I think both parties are acting childish and they both need to stop or nothing is going to get done, accept for more bitching.
Just because I don't go to many websights on my i OS device that would require flash, and thus don't miss it at all, doesn't mean that everyone does. the majority of apple users I talk to say they don't seem to miss flash on their I OS device all that much but, it would be nice if the two entities could come together and work something out rather than going back and forth with these stupid games.
As to using a computer vs. a mobile device I will say this:
First, mobile devices will outsell computers in five years or so, if the Goldmann Sax predictions are correct.
Second: The Apple mobile devices are basically the computing appliance Jobs has been speaking of since 1989. If you use an iPad, as my mentor in the Guard does, as a cloudsync app - there's a Google Docs app for iPad, and if you use the apps written for it, you will be fine.
iPad and similar forthcoming tablets aren't PCs, they aren't netbooks, they're relly a computing appliance. This is actually where Apple does get it right: They close the door, as it were, turning your pad or pod into an appliance like your PS3 or XBox in that it supports certain applications / add-ons but its power, ironically, comes from the fact it can't be indefinitely modified (perhaps by accident) by the user. The only complaints I've heard on the Flash front have been from users who are working professionals and becoming dependent on these new devices for a greater number of tasks. These devices will be as ubiquitous soon as cell phones and computers are now. One of our biggest drawbacks right now is the pricing structure for data plans. However, I know several people who are only on data plans and only use these mobile devices, no computer at all. This is where we're headed, a device that's portable, always connected (right now that's your 3G), doesn't brick (I bet you can't brick your iPad), and gives you your access to data and applications. Every one I know who is set up like this doesn't use their mobile appliance as a toy; it's their connection and they use it. Should be interesting.
I'll probably always have at least one full computer, whether it be a Desktop or Laptop, around my house. As sophisticated as the IPad and its successors might become I don't doubt there are always going to be things it can't do that a full-fledged computer can and vice versa. I imagine they're both going to have their uses for a while yet.
I DON'T DOUBT TAHT MOBILE APPLIANCES COULD OUTSELL COMPUTERS IN A FEW YEARS, BUT THINKHOW MUCH MORE POWERFUL THEY WILL BE IN A FEW YEARS, AND BY THEN U WILL ONLY NEED PC'S TO DO HEAVY LIFTING LIKE VIDEO AND AUDIO PRODUCTION WORK AMONG OTHER THINGS.
I have to agree with post 39 here. Even Steve Jobs, who is of course Apple's CEO, has that perspective. He says, "PC's will be like trucks." When you think about the iPhone's processor, it can petty much already do some heavy lifting. For right now, they say the processor runs at a speed of about 1.0 ghz. And obviously that will get faster over time.